I made an extensive explainer video about Onion Routing on the Lightning Network with a camera paid by this amazing community! Enjoy! youtube.com/watch?v=toarj…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/renepickhardt
πŸ“…︎ Jan 22 2019
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Lightning Network Onion Routing, Lack of Anonymity, and Other Woes youtu.be/rgts1qb0hLY
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πŸ‘€︎ u/don-wonton
πŸ“…︎ May 04 2018
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Does Lightning Network Onion Routing provide TOR-like privacy?

No.

In fact, LN doesn't claim to be anything like TOR. The closest association I've found is LN claims to use a "mix-net like packet". Still, some LN proponents use this comparison to "shore-up" their arguments for LN privacy.

However, there are important caveats missing from LNs stated privacy claims which clearly invalidate any similarity between the two networks.

Persistent LN channel open/close/capacity information provides a data-point which can be used to derive information about route participants.

TOR specifically avoids a similar type of information leak by negotiating bandwidth offsets on a per-circuit basis to avoid fingerprinting by observation of net-flow.

LN payments are not and will never be as private/anonymous as communications on the TOR anonymity network as long as channel open capacities are known to network participants.

The LN onion readme (archive) states;

>...by encoding payment routes within a mix-net like packet, we are able to achieve the following security and privacy features:

  1. Participants in a route don't know their exact position within the route
  2. Participants within a route don't know the source of the payment, nor the ultimate destination of the payment
  3. Participants within a route aren't aware exactly how many other participants were involved in the payment route
  4. Each new payment route is computationally indistinguishable from any other payment route

Statements 1,2,3 are invalid during common routings.

Statement 4. I dunno...

Sample Route: nodeA -> nodeB -> nodeC -> nodeD

Statement 1 is invalidated; If nodeA (originator) has no other open channels than with a forwarding nodeB.

In this case, nodeB can know that it is the second hop in the route; it can be aware of its exact position in the route.

Statement 2 is invalidated; If nodeB knows that it is the second hop, it also knows nodeA is the source of the payment.

These caveats apply to the destination if destination nodeD has no other channels except with forwarding nodeC.

(Bonus: **St

... keep reading on reddit ➑

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πŸ‘€︎ u/deepechain
πŸ“…︎ Dec 28 2018
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Is onion routing appropriate for Lightning Network?

The privacy guarantees of Lightning transactions are highly questionable. Onion routing on Lightning Network provides far less privacy assurance than it does on Tor, and the ability for intermediaries to control routing decisions opens the potential for them to deanonymize senders or receivers. In particular, [BOLT #4: Onion Routing] (https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lightning-rfc/blob/master/04-onion-routing.md) makes the following claims regarding the privacy it affords routed transactions.

  • Intermediate hops cannot know about the other hops in a route other than their immediate predecessor and successor.
  • Intermediate hops cannot know their position in the route.
  • Intermediate hops cannot know if their predecessor is the originator or their successor the receiver of the transaction.

There exists conditions under which an intermediary hop most certainly can know these facts. These conditions are met in some of the most commonly cited use cases for Lightning Network. It may also be possible for an well funded adversary to manipulate the availability of channels on intermediary systems to influence or control route selection.

The failure is primarily in the mix-net features of routing. Although Lightning allows source routing, route options are restricted by the decisions of intermediaries. This is different than the intended use case for onion routing, where hops can be selected arbitrarily. The difference in topology can be seen by comparing the Tor white paper to the Lightning BOLT documentation.

Every node on Tor is connected (or has the potential to directly connect) with every other node:

> The Tor network is an overlay network; each onion router (OR) runs as a normal user-level process without any special privileges. Each onion router maintains a TLS [17] connection to every other onion router.

> Tor: The Second-Generation Onion Router - 4 The Tor Design (page 4)

On Lightning Network nodes must share a channel in order to route directly between them:

> In the following example, it's assumed that aΒ sending node (origin node),Β n_0, wants to route a packet to aΒ receiving nodeΒ (final node), n_r. First, the sender computes a routeΒ {n_0, n_1, ..., n_{r-1}, n_r}, whereΒ n_0is the sender itself andΒ n_rΒ is the final recipient. The nodesΒ n_i andΒ n_{i+1}Β MUST be peers in the overlay network route.

> [BOLT #4: Onion Routing - Packet C

... keep reading on reddit ➑

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πŸ‘€︎ u/tripledogdareya
πŸ“…︎ Jan 20 2018
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Does Lightning Network Onion Routing provide TOR-like privacy? /r/btc reddit.com/r/BitcoinAll/c…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/cryptoallbot
πŸ“…︎ Dec 28 2018
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Does Lightning Network Onion Routing provide TOR-like privacy? /r/btc reddit.com/r/btc/comments…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/ABitcoinAllBot
πŸ“…︎ Dec 28 2018
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Net neutrality via blockchain: analyzing Loki Network’s onion routing mixnet medium.com/@mennovginkel/…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/mariejonabelle
πŸ“…︎ Jul 25 2018
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Net neutrality via blockchain: analyzing Loki Network’s onion routing mixnet medium.com/@mennovginkel/…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/mariejonabelle
πŸ“…︎ Jul 25 2018
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HORNET: High-speed Onion Routing at the Network Layer (x-post from r/darknetmarkets) arxiv.org/pdf/1507.05724v…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/turnerbackwards
πŸ“…︎ Jul 23 2015
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Net neutrality via blockchain: analyzing Loki Network’s onion routing mixnet medium.com/@mennovginkel/…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/mariejonabelle
πŸ“…︎ Jul 24 2018
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Exclusive: Bitcoin Developers Explain Addition of Tor-Style Onion Routing to Lightning Network coinjournal.net/bitcoin-d…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/Scerdoo
πŸ“…︎ Jan 18 2016
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Researchers claim they’ve developed a better, faster Tor. HORNET, a high-speed onion routing network, could be deployed on routers as part of the Internet. arstechnica.com/informati…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/hithereimigor
πŸ“…︎ Jul 27 2015
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Net neutrality via blockchain: analyzing Loki Networks onion routing mixnet medium.com/@mennovginkel/…
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πŸ“°︎ r/BitcoinAll
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πŸ‘€︎ u/ABitcoinAllBot
πŸ“…︎ Jul 25 2018
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Lightning Network Onion Routing, Lack of Anonymity, and Other Woes youtu.be/rgts1qb0hLY
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πŸ“°︎ r/BitcoinAll
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πŸ“…︎ May 04 2018
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HORNET: High-speed Onion Routing at the Network Layer (x-post from r/TOR from r/darknetmarkets) reddit.com/r/TOR/comments…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/Sachyriel
πŸ“…︎ Jul 23 2015
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Onion routing is a technique for anonymous communication over a computer network en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oni…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/ambiversive
πŸ“…︎ Jun 21 2010
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Exclusive: Bitcoin Developers Explain Addition of Tor-Style Onion Routing to Lightning Network coinjournal.net/bitcoin-d…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/Scerdoo
πŸ“…︎ Jan 18 2016
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Anonymous communication network is based on onion routing,Initially designed to improve and outperform Tor. 0x55.blogspot.nl/2016/02/…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/kimxe
πŸ“…︎ Feb 17 2016
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Exclusive: Bitcoin Developers Explain Addition of Tor-Style Onion Routing to Lightning Network coinjournal.net/bitcoin-d…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/BitcoinAllBot
πŸ“…︎ Jan 18 2016
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HORNET: High-speed Onion Routing at the Network Layer arxiv.org/abs/1507.05724v…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/qznc_bot
πŸ“…︎ Jul 22 2015
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Online Anonymity Evolved: High-speed Onion Routing at the Network Layer (HORNET) dailydot.com/politics/hor…
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πŸ‘€︎ u/GuyFromV
πŸ“…︎ Jul 23 2015
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How does a 'reply onion' in an Onion Routing network (such as Tor) not reveal the sender?

I read the wiki on Onion Routing and Reply Onions, but it is sparse in the description of how the reply onion works. I would think that, when constructing an onion destined for the original sender, the last node would need to see the sender's IP address?

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πŸ“…︎ Apr 25 2012
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